TWICM 213: Mark Kingsley on Brands in the world of AI

Mark Kingsley, brand strategist, designer, author and founder of Malcontent, joins That’s What I Call Marketing to discuss his book "Brands in the World of AI" and why marketers need to think much more deeply about artificial intelligence than prompts, productivity and tools.

Mark’s central argument is that AI is not simply a tool, it is a condition, an environment that is already changing how we work, create, build brands and relate to one another. This conversation explores what that means for brand strategy, creativity, marketing careers and the relationship between companies and customers.

Rather than offering another AI how-to guide that could be outdated within months, Mark draws on history, philosophy, psychology, design and technology to understand where AI fits into a much longer story of technological change.

In this episode, we cover:

– What the Jacquard loom, Charles Babbage, Ada Lovelace, Alan Turing and even *Frankenstein* can teach us about today’s AI debate

– AI-driven job losses, automation and the continued commoditisation of creative and knowledge work

– Why removing junior-level “donkey work” could create a serious skills and judgement problem for agencies, marketers and professional services

– Brian Eno’s idea of “scenius” and why creativity is rarely the product of a lone genius

– Agentic AI, B2A2C commerce and what happens when AI agents begin making purchasing decisions

– Why brands could use AI to move beyond transactions towards deeper relationships with people

– Why human discernment could become more valuable as AI becomes more capable

– The danger of treating AI primarily as another system for extracting efficiency and profit

– How AI might instead be used to support human flourishing

One of the most important questions running through the conversation is what happens to expertise when AI starts doing the work through which people traditionally learned their craft.

We also explore what AI means for brands themselves. If brands genuinely want relationships rather than simply transactions, Mark argues AI could help companies recognise people as individuals and members of communities rather than merely customers to extract value from.

A useful listen for marketers interested in AI in marketing, brand strategy, creativity, marketing leadership, agentic AI, synthetic research, the future of work, customer experience and the changing role of human judgement.

02:32 Why this is not another AI how-to book

04:36 “AI is not a tool, it’s a condition”

05:43 Technology, Heidegger and what technology reveals

07:38 Is AI already changing society at scale?

08:01 Alan Turing and the history of machine intelligence

09:02 Jacquard looms, the Luddites and automation

11:04 AI layoffs and the economics of replacing people

13:36 AI infrastructure and removing barriers

19:13 Photography, creativity and resistance to new technology

20:18 Why great photographers and creatives still matter

21:24 Brian Eno’s Oblique Strategies

25:18 Agentic AI and B2A2C commerce

26:00 AI personas and purchasing agents

27:02 Tokenisation and the “semiotic gap” between humans and agents

30:48 Why Mark is disappointed by the adversarial AI debate

34:13 What *Brands in the World of AI* ultimately asks brands to reconsider

This episode is brought to you by Tracksuit the always-on brand tracking platform for clients and agencies.

Find out more: https://www.gotracksuit.com

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That’s What I Call Marketing is where marketers come for real conversations about brand, B2B, creativity, effectiveness and the future of the profession.

Hosted by Conor Byrne, the show features conversations with CMOs, marketing leaders, agency leaders, authors, thinkers and practitioners about what good marketing looks like in practice.

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